Antipodean Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Hilander72 - Point well made. Sci fi is most definately as much about the here & now as it is about crazy space gadgets! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TetsuoShima Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Cheese and Rice!!!! I was hoping this place was at least ONE place I could "escape" from all this political B.S.! Apparently not. I can only speak for myself, but I have a sci-fi side that likes to come here and read and post about sci-fi, and I have a political side that took my political concerns to the White House back in September and was arrested with about 400 other concerned citizens. I take my political interests to Washington. I take my sci-fi interests to niteshdw. If people want to piss and moan about politics, I'd be more happy if that kind of discussion was taken to a political-based message board (e.g. any of the Air America Radio boards - or any of the Right Wing boards if you're a brain-dead FREAK!). I guess in the "Ten Forward" zone "anything goes", but jeeze, take the "real world" politics B.S. elsewhere. At least get into Romulan vs. Federation politics on THIS site. Good GRIEF! :-( As Antipodean said: This specific subsection of Ten Forward is suited exactly to this kind of discussion, the sub -header says: Everyone is full of treachery, deceit, and political opinions In other words, the topic is valid and should reside here for those willing to discuss it, if you don't like these kind of topics, then I advise you to just not visit the "Mirror Universe". :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S0V13T Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 And if / when things REALLY get out of hand, it's a one way trip to Rura Penthe, Where evil topics go to die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDad Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 And if / when things REALLY get out of hand' date=' it's a one way trip to Rura Penthe, Where evil topics go to die.[/quote'] Unless the U.N. takes over first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theaveng Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 The U.N. & its various sub-organizations are largely controlled by the third and second-world dictators. Hardly the type of men you want to hold up as "impartial" and "concerned about human rights". Sad. U.N. was a good idea in principle but it's now a horribly-corrupt organization. Oh, and yeah I agree we should not have invaded Iraq. What we should have done was erect giant walls at our borders (figuratively, not literally), and forced everyone entering the U.S. to undergo extreme scrutiny. Basically, no more free Visas. If you want to come here, you need to have a damn good reason. The terrorists could not have launched kamikazi attacks against New York/Washington, if they had never been allowed to enter. Okay, so we goofed. Time to seal the borders & make sure it never happens again. Also, I would have asked Mr. Bin Laden to have a meeting. Ask him, "Why are you angry with the U.S.? And what do you want?" If his demands were reasonable, like get U.S. soldiers out of Arabia, I'd negotiate with him & work out a deal. If not reasonable, and he's just a madman, shoot him on the spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moomini Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 "The United States Of America does not negotiate with terrorists" Dont you watch movies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracoons Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 they do, but they are called team mates, or something nice like that, or something like that, so they can Get the edge in whatever war they are in now, or then.. Aslong as they aren't terrorists against the US of A its not real terrorists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moomini Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 tuchét sales man... do you sit in the US congress? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theaveng Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 "The United States Of America does not negotiate with terrorists." Dont you watch movies? A foolish position. More problems are solved by talking than through bombs. If we can sit down & negotiate with the Nazis & Japanese at the end of WW2, surely we can negotiate with Bin Laden. If he's full of crap/crazy, we'll just walk away from the table & drop a nuke on him. Vice-versa if he has something reasonable to say, like "Please remove your soldiers from Arab soil" than why not listen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moomini Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 if you give any ground and let them have something that they want, you'll open the flood gates and anytime someone wants something, they'll simply follow the example set by the terrorists Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maverick Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 "The United States Of America does not negotiate with terrorists." Dont you watch movies? A foolish position. More problems are solved by talking than through bombs. If we can sit down & negotiate with the Nazis & Japanese at the end of WW2, surely we can negotiate with Bin Laden. If he's full of crap/crazy, we'll just walk away from the table & drop a nuke on him. Vice-versa if he has something reasonable to say, like "Please remove your soldiers from Arab soil" than why not listen? actually aveng (and surprisingly, i might add) i think the total opposite. you can solve problems by dropping bombs. shame its not pc anymore. talking leads to more problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbubsio Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Wow, aren't we trek fans supposed to be the ones who dream of a peaceful, equal future for all. Not 'dropping nukes' and 'shooting people on the spot'. The reason most peace talks etc fail is because violent action has usually been going on for that long that neither side is willing to make the first necessary step, it's far easier just to bomb a problem out of existance. Sad, really. :( It's all down to politics and the evil people who run our countries in my opinion. Give the common man an education and an opinion and 9 times out of 10 he/she'll say 'can't we all just get along'. But the powers that be keep the masses relatively uneducated and ignorant of world facts and feed them nothing but propaganda. It's a pretty logical conclusion that indoctrinated, uneducated people will believe whatever is told to them by a corrupt, power hungry regime. Take a step back for a second and think about the reasons behind many middle eastern countries hatred of the west. After all, for decades we've exploited those people and their resources, commited atrocities of our own (which FAR outweigh the tragic and unnecessary events of 9/11) and gotten involved in internal politics which have little or nothing to do with us. How would we feel if a foriegn power was sticking it's nose into our business how and when it liked with little or nothing we could do about it. Think about it. In the words of John Lennon - Give peace a chance :) Bubba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDad Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 "The United States Of America does not negotiate with terrorists." Dont you watch movies? A foolish position. More problems are solved by talking than through bombs. If we can sit down & negotiate with the Nazis & Japanese at the end of WW2, surely we can negotiate with Bin Laden. If he's full of crap/crazy, we'll just walk away from the table & drop a nuke on him. Vice-versa if he has something reasonable to say, like "Please remove your soldiers from Arab soil" than why not listen? There was no negotiation with Japan and Germany. Terms of surrender were dictated to them and they were left with the choice of acceptance or annihililation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonHelton Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 It's sad' date=' really. I have started to believe that the bright future that Gene Roddenberry dreamed of is never going to happen.[/quote'] The bright future that Gene Roddenburry dreamed about is world-wide communism. ......Doesn't sound very bright when you put it in that context, does it? :stare: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbubsio Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 While Roddenberry's future contains elements of communism, it hardly follows it's doctrine to the letter. Communism supports a classless society with the means of production controlled by the workers. Not the terrible regime you seem to think it is. It has to a large extent been given a bad name by the Western world in the form of the USSR, which was never in fact communist but state capitalist. The illusion of the USSR's communism was spread mostly by America who needed a new enemy to 'protect' it's people from since the old dreams of a bright future with flying cars and robots doing all the work wasn't really washing with the public any longer. Whilst I find the odd thing in trek or the odd decision made by one of it's captains to be wrong or even perhaps immoral, I know which society I'd rather live in. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDad Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 While Roddenberry's future contains elements of communism, it hardly follows it's doctrine to the letter. Communism supports a classless society with the means of production controlled by the workers. Not the terrible regime you seem to think it is. It has to a large extent been given a bad name by the Western world in the form of the USSR, which was never in fact communist but state capitalist. The illusion of the USSR's communism was spread mostly by America who needed a new enemy to 'protect' it's people from since the old dreams of a bright future with flying cars and robots doing all the work wasn't really washing with the public any longer. Whilst I find the odd thing in trek or the odd decision made by one of it's captains to be wrong or even perhaps immoral, I know which society I'd rather live in. ;) The illusion of the USSR's communism was spread mostly by the USSR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbubsio Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Hmmm, perhaps I should rephrase that bit - The Americans were largely responsible for creating the illusion that the USSR was evil because it was seen as communist with US politicians like Rumsfeld and Cheney spreading untrue rumours that the USSR had terrible weapons and must be stopped. In reality the USSR was crumbling from within and indeed collapsed only a couple of decades later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S0V13T Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Guys the topic is "Dont let the UN Control US", not "lets all point out the mistakes / lies the USA has made, and Soviet political discussions." lets get back on topic, and discuss why the USA should leave the UN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maverick Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Guys the topic is "Dont let the UN Control US", not "lets all point out the mistakes / lies the USA has made, and Soviet political discussions." lets get back on topic, and discuss why the USA should leave the UN. because theyre a crap un member and george bush who is in charge should be shot for goin to war illegally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiggy Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 "The United States Of America does not negotiate with terrorists" .........it only funds them. Ah that would be on of those M16 rifles that 'accidentally' found its way there LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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